Narssism & adoption

Recently I have been accused of misquoting someone on my blog whom I have the misfortune of 'knowing' on Y!A.  I quite happily responded to this person that I had quoted them word for word so if the comments aren't there now this person deleted the comments.  To be quite honest I couldn't be bothered looking as I know I had quoted the person.  I am not bothered this person was negative of this as I have obviously hit a nerve plus I have no problems with being cyber stalked.  Anybody who objects to me being honest of my views on adoption, coercion, infant adoption, wanting to educate people .... well .... that's your problem not mine.  Maybe it is about time you look at yourself and ask why you object to a mother who was coerced into surrendering being negative about infant adoption.  It doesn't take an intelligent person to work out that this is based on my own experience, the way people have treated me, educating myself and listening to other experiences. 

The same person accuses me of being a liar yet has recently decided that yes coercion was still going on until the 1980's.  Well except it doesn't apply to me even though my son was born in 1981 as I'm really a liar.  Yeah .... right ....as if I am going to keep up the 'lies' that I started in 2004.  I hope this person is still reading as it's been over eight years now and I am still telling the truth.  If I was a liar I would have been caught out so many times by now. 

It actually scares the heck out of me that this person is a licensed foster parent as "she" believes that more children should be removed at birth.  There are too many forced adoptions now without people like this wanting to inflame the situation more.  This person is too uneducated to understand that there are some children should never have been removed in the first place.  There are other children who should be removed from their parents yet they are slipping the net.  I have nothing against children being removed from their parents if they are being abused.  I have nothing against social services being involved with families.  This happens and it's great every time there is a success story.  There is nothing wrong with a social worker with parents so they become better parents or that they get the support they need.  Social work isn't just about removing abused children it is also there to help keep families together.  The point is nobody can know if someone will be a bad parent or a good parent until they have children.

Narcissism isn't something I thought about a friend talked about it in reference to her (reunited) son.  It got me thinking about my own son and his behaviour.  Other (online) friends started bringing this up due to me  being at my wit's end with him.  This a good definition of narcissism:

http://www.melanietoniaevans.com/articles/narcissism-understood.htm

What is Narcissism? Narcissism is an unhealthy focus on self that affects others in unhealthy ways. Everyone to some extent is narcissistic. Most people ‘want the good stuff’ and from a psychological point of view: everything we do is for some emotional ‘payoff’ - in order to feel better about ourselves and life.

The definitive quality of healthy narcissism is obtaining self-gratifying results in ways that don’t damage other people, whereas unhealthy narcissism works from the mindset: “I win, and I don’t care if you lose,” or, “Your loss is my win.” Narcissism is self-absorption coupled with destructive behaviour, and is a world-wide epidemic. 

My son has openly admitted to me and other people that he is self obsessed.  I have seen for myself how obsessed he is.  There have been many times that he has accused me off doing and saying things he has said and done.  Even when I have been able to prove that I am in the right he has said that if I am say I'm in the right then fair enough.  He has come across as treating me like a child who needs pacifying instead of admitting that he is in the wrong.  He believes he is in the right all the time.

The anti-adoption are a "culture" and a cult

That's right you've read it here first if you don't go onto Y!A and it's the latest little gem I have found.  Yes you have read that properly and if I didn't find it so funny I would now be venting.  The little gem is on this question http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=AkoUCB5KP_AXsHMJga_UkmauDH1G;_ylv=3?qid=20130301071714AAq5jfN and the question is:  "genetic mirroring" Is it a meme? If not, science link please?

The questioner got huffy so added this to her answer;  If you had to look up "meme," you probably don't know how to use it or the answer to the actual question. Thanks for trying. Mincing the word to mean what you want is not a scientific source of the claim. Neither is Wiki. 

 

I am not ashamed of admitting to using Google to make sure of my facts even if I resort to looking at wiki.  I wasn't the only one to do that so posted the first paragraph of the definition.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meme
A meme (pron.: /ˈmiːm/; meem)[1] is "an idea, behavior or style that spreads from person to person within a culture."[2] A meme acts as a unit for carrying cultural ideas, symbols or practices, which can be transmitted from one mind to another through writing, speech, gestures, rituals or other imitable phenomena. Supporters of the concept regard memes as cultural analogues to genes in that they self-replicate, mutate and respond to selective pressures.[3]

 

Of course any 'put downs' is enough for me to look for more reliable sources and came up with this one.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/m…
meme
[meem] Show IPA
noun
a cultural item that is transmitted by repetition in a manner analogous to the biological transmission of genes.
Origin:
1976; < Gk mīmeîsthai to imitate, copy; coined by R. Dawkins, Brit. biologist 

 

So far I haven't had any smart Alec comebacks to that one but I was polite in my response.  I did admit to having a giggle at the idea that anti adoption is a cult so couldn't resist adding this to my answer:

 

As you don't understand the definition of cult here is the Oxford Dictionary definition which I believe over you.

 

http://oxforddictionaries.com/definition…
Definition of cult
noun
1a system of religious veneration and devotion directed towards a particular figure or object:the cult of St Olaf
a relatively small group of people having religious beliefs or practices regarded by others as strange or as imposing excessive control over members:a network of Satan-worshipping cults
a misplaced or excessive admiration for a particular thing:the cult of the pursuit of money as an end in itself
2a person or thing that is popular or fashionable among a particular group or section of society:the series has become a bit of a cult in the UK [as modifier]:a cult film    

 

Sometimes I wish I could get into the heads of some people.  I do believe this person is just trying to get a reaction and because she hasn't she has resorted to coming out with stupid comments.  If anti adoption is a cult then I am happy to be part of it.  Nobody has forced me to be anti adoption of infants, nobody has forced me to be anti using coercive tactics to get a mother to surrender.  I came to that decision all by myself without any help.  Being educated by adoptees and finding out that I wasn't alone in being a mother who was coerced has helped me to come to terms with what happened.

 

I know I upset people who are pro adoption no matter what the consequences.  They simply reinforce my determination to be honest about my own experience.  Nobody will shut me up.  If they are offended by me that is their problem not mine.  If they don't want to be educated that's up to them.  If they don't like someone daring to tell others of the dark side of adoption then they should tell me why I am wrong.  Nobody has given me one good reason why I should shut up and disappear into the woodwork.  Being insulted, receiving hate messages and cyber bullying just makes me even more determined.

 

There will always be adopters who are so blinded by how 'wonderful adoption is'  that they don't realize some of their statements don't prove a point.

 

An example is from the above question:

"I have both biological and adopted kids. The kid most like his grandfather --- the adopted son. Mannerisms, speech pattern, tics, likes and dislikes, interests, foibles etc, etc, They are very close and physically one has blue eyes and one has green and one has dark hair and the other light brown. GM is BS."

 

My son's adoptive mother has blonde hair and blue eyes, my son has blond hair and blue eyes, I have blonde hair and blue eyes.  We were separated by adoption for 23 years yet he is more like me than her.  Whenever anybody chatted to us when he lived with us and didn't know he had been adopted guessed he was my son because we are so much alike not just in looks.  We have the same mannerisms, likes and dislikes. It would have been easy to explain that I hadn't raised him and we were in reunion but complete (and random) strangers and people I don't know well don't need to know my life history or my son's   The point is that adopters who come out with statements like the above are too wrapped up in their own lives that that they can't 'see' the reality that their adopted child might be more like their natural parents.

Adopto-Speak Dictionary

I am not taking credit for this so will simply post the link http://snarkurchin.wordpress.com/adopto-speak-dictionary-page-in-progress/ and sums it all up for me.  Obviously the link will need to be copied and pasted into your browser.

I'm doing a good job ....

.... again of infuriating my favourite person on Y!A.  For a while I had a rest from the personal attacks but this person is back with a vengeance with the attacks.


This time it is on this question http://uk.answers.yahoo.com/question/index;_ylt=AhkJfchg1BuLFa1bBgpOWKghBgx.;_ylv=3?qid=20130211152510AAmJdL1

"Edit. Pip. I would have thought you would agree with me on wha Candy Corn thinks of birth mothers. Calling them selfish, l, etc. Now I know your story is just that. A story. I would think you would be highly offended at her thinking of you as selfisg and lazy."

I never actually made a comment about Candy Corn's answer.  My favourite oerson would never be able to get a job as a mind reader as he /she can't read anybody's mind.  Candy Corn didn't ask the question and I can't remember what 'her' answer was as it's been removed.

I don't believe mothers who raise their children are lazy and selfish nor do I think mothers who surrender are selfish and lazy.  Some mothers may be lazy and selfish but it's wrong to think all mothers are like that.

My favourite person  has a vivid imagination who believes anybody who doesn't buy into the whole adoption is perfect package os a liar, a troll or both.

"That tells me you most likely never birthed a child and were forced/coerced into adoption. I really don't care if you report me."

So really I never really went through pregnancy and I have a vivid imagination on how coercion works.  In that case I have imaginary stretch marks, an imaginary birth certificate and imaginary adoption paperwork.  I also con people into people into believing me by showing them the imaginary birth certificate and the imaginary paperwork.  Of course then there are the photographs of my imaginary son and articles about my imaginary reunion.  Oh and not forgetting the imaginary interviews on television and on radio.  My, my I have been a very busy little troll who should be sent back to Troll Land  

"I'm sorry you actually agree with someone that thinks of birthmothers like that. Are you and Candy Corn the same person?"

Of course I am as I have a split personality and really trip myself up by offering different views on mothers who surrender.  Wish I had the time let alone the stupidity to do such a thing. 

"And your bullying tactics, as ineffective as they are, are also quite reportable. Your bullying doesn't work on me, so you may as well stop trying. You have a hell of a lot of growing up to do. Bullying is childish and immature."

If bullying tactics are telling the truth, telling of the dark side of adoption, giving suggestions on to tap into resources is bullying then I will continue to bully.  If bullying is telling of my own experience and telling someone of the potential negative emotions they may feel I will continue to be a bully.   If my bullying is reportable why isn't anybody reporting me?  Why hasn't my account been suspended yet?

"Marnie has bever bullied anyone on gere. But you have. Many times. Bullies deserve to get ignored, blocked, and reported. Especually those who consider birthmothers as selfish and lazy."

Marnie actually violated Y!A TOS by calling people trolls and bullies and had every right to point this out.  MFP is obsessed with thinking I am a bully.  If I agreed with MFP  and didn't mention any negatives to adoption then I would have a new best friend.  I am not going to start lying by saying adoption is the next best thing to sliced bread.

"Why didn't you get offended and threaten to report Candy Corn's question? Hm? Is it because you and she are the same person?"

I wasn't  offended by Candy Corn'Question but nor did I agree with her either.  Again I wish I had more time for leisure but I don't and I would rather be busy doing voluntary work in the community as it is rewarding.  Just getting a thank you off someone makes my day.
 
"You have no problem with anyone callibg ME a troll, but yet you'll back anyone who insults birthmothers to the hilt."

Just because I don't pull up others for calling MFP a troll doesn't mean I think they are right.  I don't pull them up because they have good reasons for thinking MFP is a troll.  MFP claims relatives go on Y!A and who I am to say this is a lie.  There are / were similar accounts on Y!A so it is little wonder that people think MFP is a troll.  I have never backed up anybody who insults mothers who have surrendered.  Why would I when I am a mother who surrendered.

"Hm.  We all know you never birthed a child and never was firced/coerced inti adopting, so you may as well give that story up. If your story was true, you'd be highly offended at being called an abandoner. Or you'd be highly offended at birth mothers being called abandoners."

Why 'my best friend' thinks everybody believes that I haven't had a child is beyond me particularly when she /he is the only person who doesn't believe me.  If I was a liar I would have got bored a long time again nor would have agreed to be in the public eye.  Just because I don't say I am offended at being called an abandoner or mothers being called abandoners doesn't make me a liar.  I don't offence as adoptees have a legitimate reason for thinking their mothers /mothers who have surrendered are abandoners.  I don't have the right to tell them not to just because they are giving an honest thought.  I would rather hear honesty.

"I'm going to say one other thing. You will not bully me into not using the term birth mother. Or even the word mother. You said the word mother is offensive in anotherquestion, yet you call yourself a mother."

I don't try and bully anybody into not using the term birth mother.  I simply say I don't like the term or it's an offensive term for a mother who has surrendered or another comment on that line.  Just because there are people who aren't offended by the term doesn't mean I should be forced to use the term.

"You also only throw temper tantrums when I say birth mother. Not when ANYONE else says it. Your behavior tells everyone your story is a complete lie. Report me all you want. Tattletales don't get taken seriously by YA, anyway."

I must suffer with selective memory as I don't throw temper tantrums just because he / she uses the term.  If I say anything it's usually to state that just because he /she thinks it's an acceptable term doesn't mean everybody has to feel the same way.  Well if my behaviour tells everybody I am a liar it says lot about 'my favourite person'.  Strange how this is the only person who regularly accuses me of being a liar yet claims everybody thinks I'm a liar.


"You know, you claim to be a mother, but out of the two of us, I am the only one offended at birth mothers being called selfish, lazy, abandoners, etc. Interesting. Makes me, and everyone else know that your story is a lie."

As I have never said I'm not offended by mothers being called abandoners doesn't mean I'm not offended or that I am offended.  I just choose not to respect how adoptees feel.  Would still love to know what gives this person the right to call me a liar and speak for everybody else.  


"The reason you get called all that stuff is because people have you all figured out. Since you are SO set on EVERYONE following the rules on here, don't reply to anything I, or anyone else, responds to in questions. To reply to what I, or anyone else says, when someone answers a question, is a violation of tos. As is bullying."

Shame this person doesn't follow their own advice and leave everybody else alone.  Every time I am accused or somebody else is accused of being something we're not then I will stick up for myself and them.  

For what it's worth this is my answer:
@Sammy ~ I am reporting you for calling Candy a troll and will keep on reporting you every time you call people trolls.

@ Marnie ~ No they aren't bullies or trolls, if they are what does that make you? Encouraging mothers to surrendering is far worse especially when the person knows what it's like to surrendering.

Because they don't know the circumstances and they haven't been in that situation. I have been called all sorts of things in my time here. I was coerced into surrendering and yet I have been subjected to things like:

- I am a liar and really chose adoption
- I am bitter
- Angry
- Blame everybody for my mistakes /choices
- The adoption couldn't have happened without my permission / my signature.
- I have even been called a troll / have multiple accounts all because one person hates me that much that she seems to want to discredit me and the truth of what happened to me.

I've had even worse than that and incidently if I had raised my son I could have done that without finnacial help as I had a job. I keep telling people the truth because there is a dark side to adoption and people have a right to be educated on coerced adoption.

@ Sammy ~ if I hadn't already reported you I would have now. You have yet again proved my point that you think I am a troll, having multiple a/cs and being a liar. Fortunately people see you for what you are and just because you believe birth mother isn't offensive doesn't make you right and me wrong. By the way are you male or female because I thought you were female based on some of your answers but others have referred to you as a 'he'.

Avoidance tactics

Despite having been on a downer since Christmas I am getting back into a routine for keeping busy.  It is the only way I can avoid thinking ... dwelling ... about adoption 24/7.  Mondays are usually a quiet day unless we are asked to help out at the church.  Tuesdays and Thursdays we volunteer for the credit union.  Wednesdays we help with cleaning the back hall, office, rooms and kitchen.  Fridays I help with the lunch club and Rick is a 'floater' so generally splits his time between the lunch club and the office.  Saturday is the only day we make sure we keep for ourselves and Sundays we are usually at church twice but if the weather is bad we generally just go in the evening.  Rick is also part of the choir but choir practise doesn't start till February.

This afternoon I was exhausted as we got to the back hall at 9.30 am so we got the chairs and tables out, I cleaned the kitchen sides and started getting out things that I could get to.  Some of the cupboards are locked when the kitchen isn't being used.  Rick spent a couple of hours in the office then went hoe because he wasn't feeling too well.  It was a good morning though and I never thought I would enjoy helping with a lunch club so much.  The people who come along are elderly and do so because they enjoy the company as much as anything.

I needed the distraction.  Yesterday I showed a couple of ladies who volunteer for the community bus and a;so go to church pictures of our pets.  It was easier showing them the pictures on Facebook than going through folders but then I got awkward questions as they spotted one of me and my son.  They don't know he was adopted and I really wasn't in the mood to explain.  It was one of those times that I was glad that he lives at the other end of the country to us.  This was good enough reason to explain why I don't see him and use my favourite line that he only gets in touch when it suits him or he wants something. 

I don't expect to ever hear from him again but I wasn't going to tell them that as it's too painful to talk about.  I wont even talk about it with Rick either.  Knowing that he believes I am not good enough for him is the most hurtful thing he could come out with last year.  Every time I thinks about that it's as if someone is twisting a knife in my stomach and I want to cry.  I wish I knew what I had one to deserve that.  People don't understand the pain that adoption causes.  They believe that mothers like me deserve what we get from our surrendered children.  They don't 'get it' that usually we don't.  Whenever I was in the wrong with my son I would apologise but he would never admit to being in the wrong.  There were a number of times I would be told by good internet friends that they believed he was a narcissist (sp) which included another natural mother who had originally sided with him when we first started falling out.  Her turning point was when he moved in with us and she found out how much he was disrespecting us just on ground rules without realising how bad his behaviour could be.

Despite every thing I still love my son and I just don't like his behaviour.  A number of times I have been told that if I loved him unconditionally then it wouldn't bother me.  I still believe a parent can love a child unconditionally but still get fed up with bad behaviour.  I am only human at the end of the day.  

Sad

I haven't had any incentive to post here since the last post.   The feeling of being 'redundant' has been strong.  I feel worn out, worn down, useless, doubting myself because of comments directed at me.  Someone who has a special place recently made a comment that I wear my heart on a sleeve.  It is true.  Negative remarks about me stay in my head whereas as kind comments are hard to deal with.  It is probably a product of my life and being told how useless I was over the years.  I eventually got brainwashed that I am a useless waste of space who will never amount to anything.  I am 51 years old and what do I have to show for my life?

Mostly me being on a trail of self destruction because I felt that I didn't deserve a good life.   I have a son who hates me, a family that tolerates me and I rub some people up the wrong way.  I am also at the point of why do I bother standing my ground on what happened to me and my son being adopted.  It would be so easy to crumple and say "Okay, I have nobody to blame for my son being adopted except for myself,£ I can't though because it would stick in my throat.

My wishes for 2013

- that expectant mothers aren't given coercive advice from adoption agencies. 
- that expectant mothers are given counselling it's non biased and adoption isn't mentioned.
- that expectant mothers are encouraged to parent by family and friends.
- that mothers who were coerced into surrendering are believed / not accused of lying
- that people accept that mothers do regret decisions without insulting them and telling them they deserve what they get.

I could go on and I may do in later posts but fir now I am keeping it simply.  I am also suffering being told that I should shut up about the dark side of adoption.  For far too long people have tried to beat me down over telling my story as it doesn't 'help adoption'.  I continually get told I am unhelpful, that I am rigid in my thoughts, I am a troll with multiple accounts on Yahoo, I am anti adoption, a liar and so on. My response is that it's good that I am upsetting people's view that adoption is wonderful.   I live in the real world and I talk about my experiences.  I have been educated by all sorts of people including adoptive parents.  I am also a mother who was coerced, I have seen the damage adoption has done to my son, I have family members who have adopted internationally, cousins who are the internationally cousins, I have friends whom I love even though they don't realize that have adopted, foster carers, adoptees and formerly fostered adults.  I haven't met a number of them and live in hope that I do